Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

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Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sun Jul 04, 2010 2:59 pm

discuss. i think not Neutral different trunks, different timeline.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:36 pm

well the creators already admitted their mistake about causing that plothole.
it was supposed to tie in with future trunks, but that didn't make sense as goku and co where long dead before even super saiyan 2 was discoverd in the other time line

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Z-Dragon87 on Fri Jul 09, 2010 3:35 pm

(Comments have been deleted by myself.)


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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sat Jul 10, 2010 6:53 am

the sword itself also seemed to be made of weird material. it didn't look like regular metal, almost looked diamond like. specialy when (normal time line) #18 blocked with her arm and the sword cracked and a few pieces broke off)
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sun Jul 11, 2010 9:32 am

lol well the androids arent harder than diamond are they? it cut hirudegarn in half so i think they are different swords altogether, but they look similar.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sun Jul 11, 2010 9:35 am

ki protection to shield body
even the z-fighters use that
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:18 pm

Yes tapions sword is futur trunks sword, that was the whole point of tapion giving the sword to trunks to tie that sword together with the future.
also were in that movie was there a plot hole?
i didn't see one, when ever there was a problem i could come up with an easy answer as to why x happended but, maybe i didn't see all the problems or just forgot somthing as it's been a while since i'v seen that movie.
Can someone explain the plot hole in that movie that make's it impossible for tapion's sword to be future trunks sword.

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Leon on Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:46 pm

Because it's impossible for Hidegarne to have happened in future Trunks time line, let alone before he went back in time.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:00 pm

Leon wrote:Because it's impossible for Hidegarne to have happened in future Trunks time line, let alone before he went back in time.

How is it impossibe? maybe improbable or highly unlikely
All that had to happen is Future kid Trunks, SSJ Future Gohan, Android #17 & #18 had to defeat Hildegarn & Future Trunks would have his sword simple.


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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Leon on Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:01 pm

Erm. No. It is physically impossible for the characters of that time period to defeat Hildegarne. Asides from that, Trunks would have mentioned it to someone, at some point, when he went back.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Syrias on Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:12 pm

also, why would 17 and 18 help the z warriors?
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:29 pm

Leon wrote:Erm. No. It is physically impossible for the characters of that time period to defeat Hildegarne. Asides from that, Trunks would have mentioned it to someone, at some point, when he went back.

1. F. Trunks happend before Hildegarne so it would be assumed that Trunks did tell the Z-Warriors about Hildegarne but by the time the Z-Warriors got to the buu saga they weren't as worried about evil's in F. Trunks Time.
Blame it on "character induced stupidity"

2. Tapion could have held in Hildegarne & when he asks Future kid Trunks to kill him Trunks must have killed Tapion which also killed Hildegarne.

Syrias wrote:also, why would 17 and 18 help the z warriors?

The real question is why not?
Androids #17 & #18 are not stupied, they would have known they were know match for Hildegarne & would have needed help just to defeat Hildegarne.
After all is said & done once Hildegarne is defeated Androids #17 & #18 would have been the strongest again

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sat Jul 17, 2010 4:20 am

pretty sure hirudegarn knocked ssj3 gotenks out in one hit. they would all be squashed.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sat Jul 17, 2010 6:46 am

the plot hole is that movie 13 happens after kid buu's defeat. (mabey 3 years later)

we see hildugram beating mystic gohan (something future gohan never reached). ssj3 gotenks and ssj2 goku and vegeta.

the makers of the movie admitting they made a mistake with trying to tie the sword with future trunks. because it doesn't fit.


in future trunks time line: no one had reached a level beyond super saiyan.
all the z-fighters where all ready dead and trunks was a teenager. not a child like in movie 13.

and future 17 and future 18 where weaker then there normal timeline counterpart.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Sat Jul 17, 2010 10:57 pm

Docter KillJoy wrote:the plot hole is that movie 13 happens after kid buu's defeat. (mabey 3 years later)
Hoi could have just came to earth 3 years later or it just took a while for bulma to get supplies to creat the machin that opened Tapion's box.
Trunks also could have had that sword threw out the entire special but never used it.

Docter KillJoy wrote:we see hildugram beating mystic gohan (something future gohan never reached). ssj3 gotenks and ssj2 goku and vegeta.
They could have fought 1st form Hirudegarn only & Hirudegarn seems to just knock people out, after he attacks he just sits there.

the makers of the movie admitting they made a mistake with trying to tie the sword with future trunks. because it doesn't fit.
I agree it doesn't fit but neither does most of the movies.


Docter KillJoy wrote:in future trunks time line: no one had reached a level beyond super saiyan.
all the z-fighters where all ready dead and trunks was a teenager. not a child like in movie 13.

and future 17 and future 18 where weaker then there normal timeline counterpart.[/quote]
Gohan was still living & just because knowone reached beyond super saiyan doesn't mean Hirudegarn couldn't be defeated.

Now for the question, "Is Tapion's sword Future Trunks sword"
Movie canon, yes
Manga canon, no, Hirudegarn never existed & nor did Tapion.

My Point "Is it impossible for Future Trunks to have gotten his sword from Tapion even though Hirudegarn was massively more powerful than everyone"
no, it's possible, all Tapion had to do was die while holding Hirudegarn within him & as for the time period it is possible trunks could have had the sword during the whole Futur Trunks special but didn't have time to grab it.

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sun Jul 18, 2010 5:17 am

he did use it. in the last fight with the androids to avenge gohan but he gets his ass kicked. hard to believe tapion came in those three years before that. also his sword shatters vs 18 but it cuts hirudegarn in half.

even first form hirudegarn was winning vs mystic gohan LOL.

actually its not even movie canon as its completely impossible even for filler.

i seriously doubt that happened (hirudegarn dying by being trapped in tapion). trunks couldnt do it in the actual movie and why would hirudegarn die by being trapped in tapions piss weak body.

the main thing is everyone is dead in the future trunks timeline. and its pretty impossible to even open the box with no dbs.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:21 am

the only movies that fit (some just barely) in the serie time line are

movie 8 (could have happend during the 10 days waiting for the cell games)
movie 9 (happend after cell's defeat)
movie 10 (could have happend before the world tournament saga)
movie 13 (happend after kid buu's dead. the sword is just a plothole mistake by the makers of the movie)


and like uft said, the sword broke against #18's arm. but managed to cut hildugram (who was beating the shit out of mystic gohan and ssj3 gotenks)

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Sun Jul 18, 2010 8:47 am

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:he did use it. in the last fight with the androids to avenge gohan but he gets his ass kicked. hard to believe tapion came in those three years before that. also his sword shatters vs 18 but it cuts hirudegarn in half.
I know Trunks used the sword at the end of the special, i was talking about Kid Future Trunks only.
Yes but SSJ3 Goku weakens Hirudegarn befor Trunks cut him.
The sword was also made to defeat Hirudegarn I think?

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:i seriously doubt that happened .
I said probable not likely or definite.
Ussj Future Trunks wrote:(hirudegarn dying by being trapped in tapion). trunks couldnt do it in the actual movie and why would hirudegarn die by being trapped in tapions piss weak body.
Dispite there DNA Future Trunks & Present Trunks in mind are different.
F.Trunks grew up in a hostile world while P.Trunks was half spoiled.
I believe Future Trunk would have killed tapion to protect everyone & hell anyone else could have done it.

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:the main thing is everyone is dead in the future trunks timeline. and its pretty impossible to even open the box with no dbs.
Thats not 100% true going by the anime & the movie, #18 who has SSJ strenght was able to break Futur Trunks sword which assumably was made from the same planet as that box that held Tapion.

Now Gohan in base trys to open it but gives up after like 2 seconds, then later Bulma's machin without any test at all scans the box & then tells her its made of some unkown indestructible material, Bulma then says nothing can open it because of this & knowone even trys to open it, Goku trys in base & gave up faster than Gohan, even though it just came from a planet Bulma nor her machin could know anything about.

The fact that #18 could breaks a sword that trunks thought was impossible to break would suggest about any SSJ could break that sword also & possibly open that box.

The only thing that doesn't make sense is Hoi reason for coming to earth, if he truly believed only the dragon balls could unlock the box then you would think he'd go to namek instead.



Docter KillJoy wrote:the only movies that fit (some just barely) in the serie time line are

movie 8 (could have happend during the 10 days waiting for the cell games)
movie 9 (happend after cell's defeat)
movie 10 (could have happend before the world tournament saga)
movie 13 (happend after kid buu's dead. the sword is just a plothole mistake by the makers of the movie)
I agree, except with Tapion's sword.
The only plothole that doesn't have a good plausable answer to it is Hoi reason for coming to earth.

Docter KillJoy wrote:and like uft said, the sword broke against #18's arm. but managed to cut hildugram (who was beating the shit out of mystic gohan and ssj3 gotenks)
And like I just stated above Hirudegarn was weaken by an unkown amount & since he didn't get one break from punching Goku, Trunks (correct me if i'm wrong) cut Hirudegarn right befor the dragon fist & no sooner meaning Hirudegarn was at his weakest during the slicing of his tail.

If so its totally plausible that #18 broke the sword that was used on the more powerful Hirudegarn & also it could be just as simple as the sword was just made to kill Hirudegarn.

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:22 am

no he doesnt. hirudegarn was cut in half a long long time before dbz happened and that was by tapions sword. hirudegarn was obviously not weakened there. never established it was forged to beat a monster that had just appeared. no time, and no way of knowing it would work.

um im pretty sure gohan > android saga ssjs. your making crap up. its not the same sword and they cant have opened the box in the future. and even weakened hirudegarn > 18. hes a million times stronger at full power and is still godly compared to 18 even at his weakest point. hell his legs withstood punches from mystic gohan easily.

why go to namek? obviously the nameks are way less gullible and would kill hoi.

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:25 am

just accept that they made a mistake with trying to tie the sword to future trunks.

because hildugram would have stomped all over future gohan, future trunks & the future androids.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Ussj Future Trunks on Sun Jul 18, 2010 10:39 am

thats what im saying. its either the biggest most impossible plot hole or a mistake.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Kalkarot-El on Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:20 pm

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:um im pretty sure gohan > android saga ssjs..
That much stronger than Base gohan?
I don't think so.
you also seemed to mis the point of knowone trying to open the box, that was my whole point combined with #18 braking Trunks sword

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:your making crap up..
How am I making things up when the conversation was about the plausibility by movie canon that Tapions sword is Future Trunks sword.

Its not like I just stated crap, I took time to explan my reasons & even gave you moments within the anime & movie to explian them.
I'v thought about my reasons a while back & weren't sure on all of them.

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:its not the same sword
& canonly i except that, but movie canonly i'v explianed why i beileve that it is.
The conversaion isn't even about if it is or not we have both agreed that it's most likly not but the question was "is it pausable there swords are the same".
& i said yes

Ussj Future Trunks wrote:and even weakened hirudegarn > 18.
You have to count Hirudagarn & Trunks sword weaker than there past counterparts.
well you don't have to but I count it.
Ussj Future Trunks wrote:hell his legs withstood punches from mystic gohan easily.
yes until gohan found his weakness, after Hirudegarn threw 3 to 4 kicks by memorie, Hirudegarn was weak enough to be knock down by gohan with ease.
Turn thoughs 3 to 4 kicks in to an attacked city with an weaker version of Hirudegarn & all you would need to win is wait for the right moment & attack when he's weak, Of course this wouldn't work & at some point all Tapion has to do seal Hirudegarn in side him & die.
Ussj Future Trunks wrote:why go to namek? obviously the nameks are way less gullible and would kill hoi.
Because its the only place with dragonballs.
Why go to earth if they have none?

Docter KillJoy wrote:just accept that they made a mistake with trying to tie the sword to future trunks.
We have all ready excepted that, I beileve that.
The conversation was about movie to filler was Hirudagarn's death & Tapion's Sword plausible.
Not is it is or isn't actually Tapions sword.

I already proven killing Hirudagarn while being less powerful was 97% pausable though unlikly they'd survive, but i'll admite like I already have the sword of Tapion's is highly unlikly & I don't think or ever beileved it to be Future Trunks, but I do believe theres a chance no matter how small that Tapion sword filler to movie could be future Trunks sword.

Hell the biggest possibilty that he could have gotten it from tapion is the fact that trunks changed the passed but all the charaters stayed the same but in the future with lower power levels & a few events were a little out of wack.

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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Leon on Sun Jul 18, 2010 1:52 pm

Guys. He's either retarded or a troll. Either way, stop.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Buster on Sun Jul 18, 2010 2:00 pm

What if F. Trunks killed Tapion before Hildegaurn could escape? Kind of like when Tapion pleaded to kid Trunks to kill him, but instead of him hesitating, F. Trunks kills him. That solves the "Hildegaurn would wipe the floor with everyone in that timeline" debate, and Trunks would still get his sword.
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Re: Is Future Trunks's sword Tapions?

Post  Docter KillJoy on Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:19 pm

there is the posibility that killing tapion woudn't have killed hildugram.
perhaps it would have worked when he only had the top half in it. but full hildugram, most likely could have survived
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